Women Artists' Experience During Israel-Hamas Conflict

Di 0:22

Welcome to the Bodyholic with Di podcast . I'm your host , Di , and this podcast is sponsored by Bodyholic , the global health and fitness community . You can find us on Instagram or on Bodyholic . fit . This is a special series called Creative Echoes Women Navigating Conflict Through Artistic Expression and we've been exploring the voices of female artists amidst the Israel Hamas conflict . Our aim is to not only understand how these women are coping during these challenging times , but also to highlight the power of their art in promoting collective and individual well-being . Today , I am so thrilled to have Merav Shacham as our final guest in the series .

Di 1:10

Merav is a highly talented promo designer and director for television and film . She is the owner of the Banana Moon Design and Animation Studio and she's the graduate of the master's degree program in visual communication at the highly prestigious Betzalel Academy of Design and Art . Merav is also a lecturer in the field of broadcasting in the visual communication department in , once again , the highly prestigious Shenkar , with a very impressive track record . Merav has worked for about five years in the promo department of Reshet , which is channel two , and as a designer and art director in several other post houses . Her clients include renowned names such as Netflix , hbo , Kan-11 , public Broadcasting Corporation , yes , hot , keshet International , united King , july-august Productions and so much more . In recent years , mirav has created captivating overtures for popular shows like Fowda , my successful sister , the Commandant , citizen K and the Police , and more and more .

Di 2:35

I'm so excited for you to hear her insights and experiences as she combines her artistic talent with her understanding of the media industry into a discussion about empathy and understanding and coping . Join us for this insightful conversation as we delve into the world of art and its ability to navigate conflict , promote well-being and inspire change . Stay tuned for the last episode of Creative Echo's Women Navigating Conflict through artistic expression with our remarkable and wonderfully sweet guest , Merav Shacham . Merav Shacham , thank you so much for being here with me . You are so incredibly talented and just a wonderful human being to be around , so I really appreciate your presence . Thank you .

Merav 3:33

Oh , thank you for inviting me it's a pleasure .

Di 3:38

Can you just say a few words about yourself and your work and what you do in the studio ?

Merav 3:45

Okay , yeah , so I think in the first thing I can say that I'm a graphic designer , but I think in the past few years it's more a director and art director , maybe In my studio . My studio is especially a title sequence . I do title sequence for TV series and movies , like all this post-production graphic stuff for the TV . Yeah , and I really enjoy it . It's like my own specialty and I also teach title sequence course in the Shankar Academy . It's a design and art academy and art direction . This is like my two main hats the studio and the two lectures . Yeah , and also I'm a musician for a really small age , a flute player musician and I really like to evolve music and sound in my works . And also I have a master degree in visual communication from Batallel and in Batallel I did some art videos , video arts I don't know art video pieces and I also composed my music in it . Oh , that's beautiful .

Di 5:44

Yes , I love that .

Merav 5:45

Like my main thing and we're going to talk about it , but in last year I have a specialty in AI animation all the stuff that evolve like artificial intelligence with generating images and generating animation and video . So this is like my new hobby .

Di 6:18

I am so not artistic and I just want to take your class . I want to go , that sounds so interesting . I just want to go and learn something , even though I would be totally , I would be a misfit , but yeah , I wish I could .

Merav 6:36

I think , I really think that if you want to learn , it's not so complicated , you can do it .

Di 6:45

Okay , okay , all right , I'll put that , I'll make a note of it , maybe during my maternity leave , yes , yes , really .

Di 6:58

So , Merab , I want to talk about the reason that I'm doing this series and this is actually the last part of the series is because it was very important for me to bring the voice of female artists to the fore who are living in Israel during this very , very complicated time .

Di 7:26

First of all , because I think that women's voices are kind of being hushed , not because they're shutting us down , but just because war is such a masculine thing and many , many men are running the show right now . So there was that . There's also the maternal aspect of the female presence . And then there's the female artist with the maternal aspect . That I find very interesting , and I think that the world has to hear us a little bit more . So when I say us , I mean women , maybe mothers , but also the creative experience that comes from you I find very , very important for my personal well-being right now , and so , as a well-being platform , it was important for me to bring artists to the fore and make people aware of you and your work , and so I'm curious how the Hamas in Israel war influenced your artistic and your creative process , even if you tell me that it shut you down . That's also legit , like it's all legit , yeah .

Merav 8:51

Wow , I have a lot to say about it and first of all , like being a woman now in this situation in Israel Jewish it's so complicated and it's so everything is so horrible and like I'm really sensitive person and I have like anxiety attacks in just a regular days , so I don't know what to say . You don't have any words left . And that's what brings me to this artistic side , or visual side , because you know words . There are so many people or women that can say write , talk about this stuff , and I truly do . I listened to what you said and I wanted to say , yeah , I was .

Merav 10:00

My artistic side was shut down at the beginning . It was very , very hard to work , to do something . You are just like all over the news and you just need to hear about stuff and to like talk with your friends . You can't create , but I wanted to do something and I feel like , as a woman , we also have like our sensitive side and we can talk , and not in like aggressive way . We can be calm and we can talk more to the heart of people , you know , and I think this is very important side in this war and also , yeah , I think you are talking about it a lot . But all the networks , you know the social networks , instagram , tiktok , everything you feel all the time attacked by I don't know pro-Palestinian and stuff and my like . I originally an artist , left side liberal , for human , you know , really for humanity and to live here in Israel . It's so complicated for us as an artist because you don't agree with that , you don't all the time agree with the government or you don't agree with the government .

Merav 11:57

And you really try to do your own little thing to influence people and it doesn't work all the time . And now it's really really , really difficult and you feel like you lost in a battle of your life to make other people hear you . And you know I'm part of many , many galleries and museums account . I follow lots of artist accounts in the world and magazines , museums and I see really big part of them are like against Israel or against what's happening , and you feel lost . And in this thing I created two pieces . One piece was with artificial AI animation and it was really I think I created it in the eight or nine of October . It was really when things were happening .

Merav 13:16

And it was about what Hamas did . It was like horrifying one and I was thinking if I want to upload it , because it was too aggressive , maybe a little bit , but I felt that I want to show this monster quality of what it did , because I didn't see or hear even in the like orphan movies , stuff like that , and I heard so much maybe too much of what they did and it was really , really influenced me and I wanted to make people feel it . And also I have followers in Hollywood , you know , because I'm making I made title sequence of Fowder of like lots of HBO and Netflix productions and I have followers from Hollywood and I have followers from all sorts of post production companies and studios around the world and I want to upload this and I wanted them to feel it and to watch it . And after , I think after two weeks , I decided to make one more animation piece , really small one and it was really gentle and like a more sensitive one and more maybe even child , a little bit like a child , half-native piece about the hostages , to bring home the hostages , the children , all the people that are kidnapped together .

Merav 15:19

And these two pieces I made , I created , and you know it's really hard to create . Now it's really hard . Your mind is so hectic and so I cannot focus , and it's really not easy . I'm also a mother for two little girls and I need to take care of them also and I need to explain them also the stuff that are going on right now . Some of them they know from school , from friends . Part of them they know because all our streets in Tel Aviv covered with pictures of kidnapped people . Every day people are dying , every day soldiers are dying . So many worries . So to be an artist right now it's really challenging and I think my most care as an artist is that I want other people from all over the world artists , people , designers I don't know people from my musicians , people that I really care about culture and art will find a place in their heart for both sides , because I do really worried about the Gaza people . I know they're suffering , I know they're dying , I know they're fighting for both sides .

Merav 17:15

I always think about the two sides and the story is so sad and so complicated and I'm 45 years old and I remember from my childhood the war , and another war and another thing and another attack and dying , and I remember in the age of 16 that I was protesting for peace , like in the days before Robin was killed . And I think lots of artists here in Tel Aviv are like me and there is a really special guy . His name is Inon .

Merav 18:14

I need to remember his family name , but his both parents were killed in the 7th of October and I always share his reals and posts because he's always saying he's not seeking for revenge , he's seeking for peace and he's seeking for truth and ceasefire and I really think that if those people were in the government things were different or better and I really pray that all these things will stop and in some sense will come to our leaders , because we can't go like this anymore .

Merav 19:10

I really believe that we are you are and me and lots of our families and friends and people from Gaza and Palestinian people want peace and want quiet and want to live and we want to make our art and design and we want to make music and we want to live like all the other people . And it's hard , it's a hard time .

Di 19:45

I so relate to , first of all , everything you said . Everything you said hits me right in the middle of my heart , but also the sense of not really doing anything except for dealing with the war and the situation and the concern about the aftermath and the repercussions , and which is actually what led me to going from a very , very science based podcast to creating a series within the podcast that is about talking to the world and reaching out and showing something from within here what we're going through and the people who live in Israel , and specifically the female voice and suddenly I don't want to talk about push ups and sets and reps , and it's in the back of my mind right now , also because I'm thinking about my daughter and I'm thinking about how to create a better world for our children and the fact that she knows exactly what to do in a siren , during a siren , and she knows that there are people who are bombing us . She knows because there's a point where you can't show your code anymore .

Merav 21:17

Yes , you can't cover it anyhow , you know .

Di 21:25

Yeah , the sense of betrayal that you were mentioning . You didn't actually use that word and I think I kind of am super , super imposing it because I'm feeling a sense of betrayal from the world and when you're saying that , like you're following , you have all these people around the world who you interact with on social media and professionally and you're seeing things that they're posting . This is something that I'm very concerned with in general . It takes over my thoughts a lot throughout the day and I think what you're doing is so important , the fact that you're creating and posting and doing what you can in your format to explain the situation . I think that's huge and I'm also curious in the ways that you do believe in .

Art and Design's Power in Conflict

Di 22:35

Furthermore , from what I just said , that art and design can contribute to fostering understanding and empathy right in the middle of the conflict and the political tension .

Merav 22:55

You know we're talking about it a lot between the lecturers in the Art Academy , because we are talking about asking the students to make some of their contributions to the situation , because I think it's not only graphic design , it's also yes , it's visual communication , like we are communicating with the visuals . I think yes and also artists .

Merav 23:29

I think we have a really strong part of in this war , in those social networks . It's like our gallery , you know . So I think it's a great influence because , like I said , like words and to talk and to write , it's not like images . Images have their own impact and I think this impact can be very , very strong . And also visual communication . You can work with typography , where you can work with illustrations , you can work with photographs .

Merav 24:18

You know , you can sketch , you can do anything and we have our inner force , you know , inner part of like , as an artist , we can look at things a bit different and we have our imagination and also I'm making animation videos , so I work with the sound , and sound is really , really important and I think we have important , really important part in this to show the world our point of view , you know , and our point of view is , like I said , it's not only to shout out .

Merav 25:15

We can do it also quietly and we can do it also like with something small or with a really good idea , but modest , you know . So I think it's really important and you really need , as an artist and a designer , to think what you want to say yeah , because this one is really really important , and you need to think deep how to show it and what to show and how to show , because everybody's are so sensitive right now . So you know it's also . It's , you know it's what we teach . We teach our tool how to think visually . So now it's really a good time to show it , because find is very , very social thing . You know , we , you know , like I'm not really in this part , but you know , a graphic designer can make signs and graphic designer can make posters and the graphic designer can make I don't know newspaper ads and it can make also , you know , websites and applications and everything . So we have so much tools in our hands .

Merav 26:57

And yeah , to create .

Di 27:06

And the fact that you're talking about communicating the visuals . That's exactly what I've been feeling since October 7th is the lack of words , and like I mean people who listen to the podcast and follow me know that that's totally my thing . My thing is words and exactly like you're seeing me right now , it's like you've left me speechless , like the world has left me speechless , and that's absolutely where you come in and where your colleagues come in and in creating things that we can't speak , and whether it's because we can't find the words or whether because the words are , we can't say them , you know .

Merav 28:06

Yeah , I think speechless is really like a really big word right now , because every day you became speechless again and again .

Di 28:20

Right , right , right , we're exhausted , we're exhausted , we're exhausted , we're exhausted .

Merav 28:29

And I think you know at the end what worked for me or I think what is working in Israel , since I remember is the communication and the relationship one-on-one , because when you are talking with people one-on-one and when you meet people one-on-one also in Israel , arabs , muslims , christians , people from another countries or I don't know when you talk one-on-one , people can understand , people can relate and people became more open-hearted .

Di 29:27

And .

Merav 29:28

I think this one-on-one . If we could do it in other ways , like social ways , social media , I don't know podcast , instagram , tv , I don't know . If we could do this one-on-one with the people that now are against Israel , things would be different .

Di 29:59

Oh my God , I totally agree . Yeah , because I totally . I think about that a lot .

Merav 30:05

We are people , you know we are all the same . It's really a cliche , but I really believe that we are all the same and everybody hurts their hurt , everybody has their pains . We all have pains , we all have . So , you know , if I don't think the reason is so important , we need to talk . You know , we need to have the comfort with each other . So I think this is also . It also makes me feel as an artist , that I want to speak to one person , not to everybody . I want to speak just from one , just from you , and that's all . Just that . I want you to understand me , that's all . Or you don't even need to understand . You can only think something , that's all .

Di 31:22

That's kind of how I feel when , like I'm seeing people you know really calling for the genocide of our people and I'm sitting there . It doesn't make me feel like I want to get up and get in their face . It makes I don't even want to shout . I'm like , wow , you're really hurting my feelings . Like can we just have a cup of coffee ? And like that's really my reaction . It's not that I don't , oh .

Merav 31:56

I can Sorry Also , I hear them , I can understand . I understand why they do it . I understand why they want it . Yeah , because that's a lot of suffering right now . But you know it's not me that caused yours . No , it's not me , that's Right .

Di 32:18

You know , killing you , right , right , no , just hear me that's all Right , absolutely , absolutely , yeah it's , it's so complicated .

Merav 32:36

It's like sometimes it's so complicated for people to understand , but it's really simple .

Di 32:42

It's actually so complicated . It's so hard for people to understand the complications , because I'm looking at the world and it's like they cannot accept the fact that it's not black and white . It's not it's we're talking about . Like we're not talking about history from a few years ago . We're talking about a very , very , very , very , very long history and we're talking about issues within each people , right ? So there's Palestinian issues within Palestine , there's Israeli issues within it all gets mixed up together . There are global issues and it's so much more complicated . And , honestly , if you really want to understand , if you really want to go out in the streets and demonstrate , like first really educate yourself . It's so harmful to just go out and say either black or white and then that takes time . But on it , it's so important , it takes motivation , you know , yeah , yeah , it takes In our days it's really easy .

Merav 33:55

You have your phone . It's really easy to be Whatever you want to be , mean to be Right , you know , yeah , you know , but worlds were all over the world . It's not like only Israel and Palestine , it seems like everybody . All the focus is here . But there is another war in Ukraine and Russia .

Di 34:38

Listen , I was just talking about the fact that the Ukraine actually needs so much attention right now and we actually need a little less attention . And I'm like , can someone please talk about the Ukraine ? Not because I want to revert the attention , because literally they need so much attention right now , they need so much support , and it's amazing that the focus has completely shifted , completely and the algorithm also of social media feeds into whatever it is yes , of course , yeah , yeah , yeah .

Merav 35:11

And also it's important for me to say that Israeli government sucks Sorry , it sucks and Hamas government , or whatever they are , sucks and they are all fucked up , and it's something that we have to be truthful about it , absolutely . And to say I'm protesting against this government for like two years now . Yeah , it's awful , I don't want them to be there . I want all of them to go and I really think that Gaza people I don't know , I think most of the people doesn't want Hamas there .

Merav 35:56

I heard that there are fear from Hamas and we are trapped here . We are trapped here . This is also something that the world needs to hear from us .

Di 36:09

Absolutely 100% , and I was just commenting on someone who I ended up reporting and blocking because it was just too mean . I didn't want them in my energy and my sphere . But I did say like I'm okay with bringing to court Netanyahu and I'm okay with there's a lot of people who are doing currently and have done extreme wrong bias , and I mean I'm okay with that . But , like you said and like you're describing , there's it's so much more complicated . There's the individuals . There are the people within who don't want these governments and also I mean I speak to soldiers who are out there in Gaza and they don't want to shoot a single innocent human being . They absolutely do not want to . They do , however , constantly have reminders everywhere and no end don't want these people to come into their homes again and rape their women and kill their children . And now we're finding out that it's not only raping their women , it's and killing and mutilating , and I mean this is .

Di 37:39

I have a friend who says here's how I think of Israel . This is the non-Jewish person who lives in New York . He says here's how to think about Israel . A guy walks into a bar with his wife Okay and then another little guy starts bad-mouthing the wife and kind of getting in her face and her husband's looking and he's like what , just back off , back off , trust me , you have to back off . And then it gets really , really violent and it escalates . And then that guy , the husband , completely wipes out whatever is left of that person and then he's prosecuted and I'm like that's such a good way to put it . That's Israel . I'm thinking of the soldier now . I'm thinking of the soldier that the guys that we hang out with in Tel Aviv , and they don't want innocent people to be hurt . They do want to avoid anything like October 7th for the rest of forever .

Merav 39:01

Yes , of course , of course . Yeah , that's why it's so complicated because people can understand , like what else do you think we should do ? I don't know . No , you know what else ?

Di 39:20

I also don't want people in Gaza to be afraid for their lives to protest . I mean , isn't that basic human right to say like , yes or no to your government ?

Merav 39:34

You know , we think , I think for the past 20 years , but tomorrow , because I was 25 , we think so many years we think and things need to change really deep have changed . The things are only escalating all the time and you feel like you don't have any control . And you know , lots of my friends went to live outside of Israel and lots of artists can't live here , anymore , lots of people .

Merav 40:17

But now you have these times , and this time you have your war and your family is in danger , your friends are in danger , some of them in the army , some of your friends died , some , you know some . Lots of people lost their relatives .

Yearning for Change and Connection

Merav 40:37

And out of the country , anti-Semitism are glowing and you feel you really feel trapped because you don't agree with anything that's going on and you say , okay , but it's like bringing me to this thing . I mentioned before that I'm trapped . I'm trapped . I really want a big change . I want it for my life , for my life , for my well-being , for my children , for my family , for my friends . There are really good people everywhere here in Gaza and you know . There are really good people in Lebanon , in Egypt , in Jordan , in Syria . There are really good people here . Why do they have to suffer so much all the time ? Why , for the land ? It's only a land .

Di 41:44

Let's talk about also the fact that , within Iran , the voices that come out , that for peace and for equality and for compassion , the voices coming out of there are overwhelming for me and like I want to hug them all the time . I'm gonna say that , the integrity and the sensitivity of what you were describing earlier . I'm gonna go back for a minute of think . Before you create , what do you wanna convey to the world ? What do you wanna put out there ? I think your students are very lucky to have you and I think that is really , really important . And if everybody really internalized that , whether it's in words or in music or in art , a moment of what do you wanna put out in the world , that is my big takeaway from what you're saying and I'm very , very grateful to you .

Merav 42:56

Thank you so much , ed . You know , our students are really , really amazing and they're really creative and they want to be part of what's going on . And also , when you talked , I was thinking , you know , maybe , like some of the crew of the art academies need to run the country , but it will be if the art academy will run the country , will manage the country or run the country , because , yeah , it really can be a nice experiment , and we're always talking about women . You know women to be there and not men . But this is another . We need another hour just to yeah . But , yeah , I hope my words will be understand and get sympathy for other people and I really , like , I feel I want to invite them to my house , you know , like make dinner with me and we can talk like eye to eye , because this is the way , absolutely .

Di 44:31

Yeah , I am not going to take any more of your time , but I just want you to know that , like I could like , really it's such a pleasure to talk to you and thank you so so much .

Merav 44:50

Thank you , we're going to be good guys .